Despite numerous reports, the NH Fish and Game Department continues to have no physical evidence of mountain lion presence in the state. So one thing that I find fascinating about this Connecticut cat was six months between the New York situation where they found evidence of it too when it was hit by a motor vehicle. The females disperse a shorter range and once they find a vacant home range they stay in that location and live there. Theres tracks everywhere. When you talk about a bobcat Bobcat maybe 80 90 pounds and then a mountain lion could be between 130 and 180 pounds. What kind of animal is that. How far were you from this cat. Peter Biello: I did mention four feet nose to tail would be kind of small for a mountain lion. WMUR NH Chronicle Mountain Lions in NH Part I and Part II. Is there a way we can learn more about these dispersing mountain lions that may travel through the Granite State and that I would ask you certainly part about whether or not a he's spending too much time chasing down these kind of false leads or B would rather be doing something else that is more informative to whether or not we actually have or can prove that we have dispersing mountain lions in the state. Today on the exchange we discuss what residents may have been seeing and what breeding mountain lion pairs would mean for our ecosystem. Caller: Oh yeah. Peter Biello: Mm hmm. 19 Give us a call if you have a question or comments or story about perhaps seeing a mountain lion here in New Hampshire. So now what's going on. The report came in from a conservation officer. Is that typically what was happening there. From came from out west they tracked it all the way back to the Black Hills in the Dakotas. Peter Biello: Hmm. I saw the tail end of a literally from behind the shoulder The Long Tail mountain lion crossing the highway going from Password to often Village downtown. I just don't understand the mechanism for how that would happen. Tim Yeah. Tell us your story. Patrick Tate: Nice talk to you too. I had a resident in New Hampshire tell me a story of a mountain lion in the 1960s where a person who would come summer in New Hampshire and then live in a different part of the country in the winter had a trailer that was housing his mount line. I wasn't employed as biologists at the time of a situation that's been reported but so I started digging into this report and spoke with another wildlife biologist with the agency and said Do you know anything about this. So before we get to the the the the stories of sightings we're getting a lot of calls. There wasn't a distinct subspecies the North American mountain lion is all is all one species and then you can find a genetically distinct South American subspecies. Mountain lions can be found throughout Arizona, and data suggests the populations are not only stable, but growing. But also I think it proves the opposite point which is that sometimes they're pretty secretive because all the way from Minnesota where the where was the first time was picked up on a game camera to New York. 1 800 8 9 2 6 4 7 7. Some of the reports that I looked into that were actually on file at the local fish and game office were even from people who did not live locally. Peter Biello: Let's talk to Ron and where Ron thanks very much for calling. Let us know your story and share your photos. So take care of this problem. He shifted gears in 2016 and began producing Outside/In, a podcast and radio show about the natural world and how we use it. His work has won him several awards, including two regional Edward R. Murrow awards, one national Murrow, and the Overseas Press Club of America's award for best environmental reporting in any medium. Are there Mountain Lions in NH? And I have to use that word allegedly because there is so much dispute about what people see and what they actually see. Thank you. Me Im willing to believe its possible that there are some out there. The nonbelievers are going to say Show us your evidence and show us prove this to us. Patrick Tate: Well I've never seen an Easter cougar so I can't say when I've handled these 10 cougars and whatnot. But no proof was offered. Give today. It's bigger but bigger and better world. The second story window through about 30 feet away from it. Caller: It had just left that field and was out. We mentioned that one cat that was hit by a car where it has it that it was a male looking for me. Listeners we'd love to hear some of your thoughts on this. If you go on YouTube and search mount lion Pat you can see people patent their hundred pound kiddie like its regular mascot cat. You treat it as if it's a sincere situation. So they're scary. Caller: Well I think Patrick I recognized your name. Mountain lions don't usually travel more than 100 miles from where they are born. Someone's got to see one they're very secretive. And that the Florida panther was more closely related to the eastern outline than the western mountain lion was. They don't know the direction they're going. Peter Biello: And then it ran away okay. If it's just in the middle of a greenfield you can't prove anything. The most common areas to see mountain lions in Arizona are in places of rocky and mountainous terrain. A monthly donation of $5 makes a real difference. DNA from scat or from fur, a clear track that is confirmed by an expert, or a photo that clearly shows a mountain lion. They're just moving around freely. If youd like to submit a question (or send a mountain line photo) you can record it as a voice memo on your smart phone and send it tooustidein@nhpr.org, OR call our hotline, 1-844-GO-OTTER (1-844-466-8837) and leave a message. We'll push great photos to the front page. Thank you. Select image for larger view. Had great trees behind it beautiful ferns on the ground so it brought me down on the site and the ferns on the ground matched. Its distinctive featurethe one that sets it apart from other North American wild catsis its tail, which is thick and often as long as its body. Verifiable pictures recorded by the observing person or a trail camera. Rick van de Poll: Absolutely. Patrick Tate: Martin Like what about Panther Panther saying animals same animal and like a bit of trivia Guinness Book of World Records says the animal with the most names is in English alone they're supposedly 40 names for Mount lion. www.wildlife.state.nh.us, Buy or Renew Your Saltwater Fishing License, Great Bay National Estuarine Research Reserve. So when we talk about the threshold of evidence required to say for sure you have seen a mountain lion it is rather high. Sam Evans-Brown: Well first I want to sort of explain why what the theory is but then also throw a bit of cold water on it because I don't think there's much much logic behind it but essentially is that if fish and game were to acknowledge that there was a population of Mount lions in the state there's a chance that something like a listing under the federal Endangered Species Act might happen and then there'd be you know some they'd have to put a plan in place to protect the species there'd be you know restrictions put on development. There are corollaries in other states. So maybe a good pet for you but not for your neighbor if you just stop by unannounced. The Eastern mountain lion is extinct in the eastern United States and Canada, but in 2011, a . However if if and when it does happen it takes up a lot of resources looking at that situation and identifying what's going on because when you start out you don't know it's a hoax. So that that's more or less I think why I'm here and why I got into this in nineteen ninety nine I found a what appeared to be a print of a mountain lion and that was in the Osprey mountains and I thought well OK that's that's a print. Many people in New Hampshire have claimed to have seen mountain lions. And those are not the same things. And I saw you cat about four feet long from nose to tail come across from the water across the road and just leap over a six foot perimeter fence in a single bound. Sam Evans-Brown: What he would have stopped as well I think is way way that the reason that mountain lion kept moving is because he wasn't finding anybody. Peter Biello: Wow. So I will just say this is a big reason why there have not been confirmed sightings I think is that the evidence required first. And there are thousands of mountain lions killed every year legally through hunting, and there have been untold tens of thousands of mountain lions killed by hunters over the last hundred years, says Mark Elbroch, the Puma Program Director for Panthera, a global wild cat conservation organization, So even the folks who live with mountain lions still have a fancy and see something thats not there to me thats incredible.. So I think the point that I just want to get across is that there is a very strong sense this here in the and not region that there is that there is some sort of mountain lion population how large it is how extensive it is. Nicholas Handy can be reached at 924-7172 ext. Tonight, Sean McDonald investigates,. She was having a garden party on her back porch and everybody in the party saw this mountain lion across the field down below the porch. I don't know if she still is. Really appreciate it. That's why we always go back to the physical evidence to support what they're reporting. So here in New Hampshire when a person turns in something that the Department believes is possible mountain lion and believes it should be investigated further. Right. Residents from Bedford to Berlin have been reporting sightings for years. And it was unmistakable. Do you want to see real, living mountain lions that do exist in New Hampshire. I don't see the hoaxes anymore at that level. I noticed it had a really big sweeping tail that kind of curled up behind it and all but still at that point because everyone says there's no mountain lions here. Hunting is legal, but closely regulated by the state. Second when I when they did forward it from Wyoming to to Michigan you know this was coming right from sample 18 and 19 had no remarkable differences from known mountain lions from Michigan or Wyoming. So Marty can you see what I'm getting at is the public sees different names and thinks that they're different animals but it's all the same animal. If you believe you have seen a mountain lion and want to report it to NH Fish and Game, please contact the Wildlife Division at (603) 271-2461 or wildlife@wildlife.nh.gov to request an observation report form. Do cougars live in New England? Rick van de Poll: Rick van de Poll so I was a non-believer as well. Patrick Tate: Exactly I was gonna bring that up juvenile male of. Rick van de Poll: Yes. Author of The last woman in the forest on Saturday July 13th at 7 p.m. at Warner town hall Warner historical dawg. So hard to know hard to refute if there's no interest in making up a story which many people of course do then I would respond the same way as Pat did. Peter Biello: Ok. So you know until I found those two scats I didn't think that mountain lions were here in the east. Mountain lions leave a lot of sign. Have a photo. But on the other side of that coin there is this sense that there have been so many sightings locally and you guys Patrick you might recall the name the Wyndham McCracken she kind of turned herself into a local authority off authorities the right word but she was very dedicated to this. Do they travel. Almost all species disperse greater distances than females. The best documentation we have in New Hampshire suggests there hasnt been a mountain lion killed by a hunter in this state since 1885. Having not found any evidence is not the same as saying there are no mountain lions, its the same as saying we dont know. Sue Morse: The big cat really commands the utmost respect not so much fear but fascination. Peter Biello: Yeah well what do you think Pat is. Information online ad an age student loans dawg. Sam what's the incentive for the government to deny allegedly. Patrick Tate: Yes. That's too big for Bobcat. So this whole illegal pet trade black market pro trade thing does does exist in a situation like that can happen. So I reached down to grab the camera and looked back and like a ghost it's gone. Patrick Tate: So Cougar Mountain Lion katama. Theres a project called the Cougar Network that tracks verified sightings, and they are all around us: Massachusetts, Connecticut, Maine, New York and New Brunswick have all had verified sightings over the past 20 years or so. Peter Biello: Nice to be here. HOLDERNESS, N.H. (AP) Two of the known mountain lions in New Hampshire have spent their 15 years in close proximity to humans. You know you have to have a license and it's hard to get that license a license to own a mountain lion. I believe I saw one that's fine and I'm not looking for an immediate story. And we want to know your stories if you have them 1 800 8 9 2 6 4 7 7 or email exchange at an HP bar dot org we'll talk about conspiracy theories when we come back. Known to exist in the state for over well over a hundred years. Peter Biello: The number is 1 800 8 9 2 6 4 7 7. So so. Peter Biello: Yeah some of what she was saying sounds like it would require getting pretty close or at least having a nice zoom lens right Sam like. Well Is DNA the most reliable means we have of identifying whether or not what we saw is actually a mountain lion. Patrick Tate: So it's interesting it's brought up. I've collected scat samples I've got several in my collection. But Absence of Evidence Is Not Evidence of Absence, Right? So I hate the idea that there's some sort of upward you know downward pressure from the bosses saying Don't you know don't tell about the mountain lions because it'll scare away the tourists. Peter Biello: They make great mascots at least. And here we're talking about in this situation we're talking about it migrated from the West. Were there any differences between these two that we could have noticed right off. Sue Morse: First and foremost if you have color or if you could see details of color look at the front of the face around the Pumas muzzle the muzzle itself is pure white. For me as a person who's handled many bobcats and looked at many pictures Bobcat the White chin Bobcat right off is what comes out to me and then the black the the roughs on our Bobcats we'll have sometimes have black fringes on them. So I would put this in the category of sort of like shark attacks right. Peter Biello: This is the exchange on an PR. Gotcha, so the Deep State is suppressing mountain lion news in order to prop up New Hampshire tourism? 44-H Links. And to anyone listening I would just say you know fishing game who wants proof right. And they asked me about the tail which I just did not remember that tail out of that whole experience. Fish and Game then deny the evidence. So. We've met Fish and Game's BURDEN OF PROOF. Sort of dropped onto the SD card of a camera he'd set up out in the wild. Peter Biello: Ok weird question but do they make good pets. There's a lot of photographs that you can see that it's very clearly a tabby cat that someone has thought was a mountain lion. The exchange is a production of New Hampshire Public Radio. We did a short segment about mountain lion sightings earlier this year and and after which I was sent a photo and also a video recording that was mostly just audio because it was so dark the photo just a quick reverse Google image search you can put images online and see where else where else they've been posted revealed that the photo had been taking out taken out in Wyoming and has been used you know hundreds of times to claim and the person who sent it to me said it had been taken New Hampshire. Well let me ask maybe Pat and Rick about this. Peter Biello: So Patrick today Fish and Game no downward pressure on you to deny the existence at all costs of mountain lions here in New Hampshire. There is some information that suggests that it spent a portion of its time in Massachusetts near the Claiborne reservoir. Seems reasonable! A lot of times. Mountain lions live in the state. As far as I could tell there was a positive DNA sequence coming from the scat sample Patrick.
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